Question About Silicon Tires

[Kemtronracer]

I know from reading on several blogs that silicon tires can leave a track slippery after running for a while. But most of the time, everyone is talking about the "cast" silicon tires either home made or produced by a supplier. Is the same thing true of silicon coated sponge tires?

[mikeinclover]

No silicone tires do not leave the track slippery. If that was the case no one would use them. Silicone just like any other type of tire does leave a deposit on the track but it is not slippery. As for foam coated tires I think it all depends on the silicone you use for them. I have been coating foam tires for a few years now and we have never seen any more residue with them than we see with any other tire.
Mike

[HomeRacingWorld]

I agree as well. I used Permatex flowable windshield silicone when I did my old foams and did not effect anything.

I have also ran countless laps on our track testing silicones for years now. It has never made it "slippery".

[Kemtronracer]

So you're telling me that you can run a bunch of cars with silicon tires, then run some cars with urethane tires and the track won't be slippery. Here's a quote from another post on HRW:

"I think the PPR Tires are a silicon tire which if they are run on a track that runs primarily rubber / urethane, it ends up making the surface slick/slippery for the rubber/urethane tired cars (kind of like spraying silicone spray lube down - but not quite that drastic) "

I have read countless posts that say essentially the same thing. Personally, I want to run both silicon coated tires and urethane tires, but my fellow racers are concerned about the silicon causing this problem.

[HomeRacingWorld]

Well I don't have that issue here. Maybe it's the amount of rubber and wear in I have built up?

I just did a track test of new silicone tires coming. I ran about 250 laps in each lane. Different cars, motors, etc.

After which I relaxed a bit and raced my recent Monogram Ferrari that has the PG's I usually use.

Not a problem. Hooked up fine.

[Kemtronracer]

I believe you, Harry. I just need to convince my other racers who run mostly 1/32 scale cars. They will swear that running silicon tires will pull the rubber off the track surface, creating little rubber "marbles", making the track slippery for urethane tires. My goal is to run both on my track, but they won't let me run my cars with silicon tires on their tracks. And you can see from the quote in my earlier post that this is a common perception.

[Abarth Mike]

There are many posts on forums about this subject . General consensus seems to be that cars running on a certain lane do suffer grip problems if some cars with silicone tires have just run that lane. Grip does come back to the lane but it takes a while.

As for not being allowed. F1 say Pirelli tires only, some oval track series say Hoosier tires only and actually specify the compound and sizes. So if some tracks have classes in which certain tires are mandated or owners who say you can only run certain tires then that's what you have to do. Not everything in life is based on science or logic.

[F1Fan]

Here is my understanding, your results may vary, proceed and read with caution! (these discussions can sometimes get heated)

Silicone cleans. Have you ever seen those pet hair and lint rollers that you can buy? You roll the roller over the furniture and it removes lint and pet hair, you then wash the roller and it is ready to use again. These rollers are reusable unlike the rollers with the tear-away sticky tape. The reusable rollers are made from a soft silicone, and stuff sticks to silicone. This is the same reason why, unless your track is super clean, silicone tyres loose their grip and you need to clean them, they easily pick up dust from the track. Once cleaned, silicone tyres have amazing grip again.

Rubber and urethane tyres are less fussy (or is that fuzzy :D ) about dirt and dust, but they work best once a track that is rubbered in. When you run silicone for long enough on a track that is rubbered in, the silicone will clean the track and remove the rubber. Just like that reusable silicone lint roller. The rubber or urethane tyres will now have less grip than before.

Like I said, your results may vary, but I think not... :)

[Kemtronracer]

[HomeRacingWorld]

Well, since you are going to get different opinions...all you can do is test yourself and come to your own conclusions.

You are right, this comes up all the time and there are too many different answers. I stand by mine, others swear by theirs. :)

Different track surfaces, different conditions, different opinions.

If you visit a track that does not want silicone, well guess you have to comply if you want to race.

[btaylor]

Great Discussion! I have learned that i need to get a silicone lint roller to add to my sticky tape one!



On my Oval, the only thing that really takes away traction, is a Piranha motor!, it does not seem to care what kind of tires i run.
Bob

[TuscoTodd]

[RichD]

I have done a great deal of testing with HO tires under very carefully controlled conditions, so I do not have to rely on anecdotal evidence with respect to those. I started racing 1/24th cars in 1965 and 1/32nd cars in 2005 and have entered nearly 2000 races in all. I have used rubber, foam, urethane, SILICONE, and SILICONE coated foam tires.
For a start there is no tire that I know of that works well for long on a dirty track. Just because you vacuumed or wiped down the track does not mean that you got up all of the dust. Rubber tires gradually leave a coating of rubber on the track and they get their best grip on a track that has been rubbered in. Foam tires act about the same way, but they tend to get hard and loose grip more quickly. On 1/24th commercial raceway tracks tire conditioner is commonly used on foam tires. For home use few people use "tire goop" on foam tires because it can make a mess, so SILICONE coated foam tire are more common.
On a perfectly clean track SILICONE tires have somewhat better grip than urethane tires. Dust sticks to SILICONE tires, so if there is any dust at all on the track they will get coated and loose grip. Rolling SILICONE tires over sticky tape is a quick way of cleaning them. If you run a car with SILICONE tires on a slightly dusty track and clean the tires every few laps you will eventually get the track (at least where the tires roll!) perfectly clean and frequent tire cleaning will no longer be needed. SILICONE tires will gradually leave a small amount of residue on the track surface. SILICONE tires have the reputation of removing the rubber buildup on tracks where rubber tires are mostly used. I have not run under those conditions so I can't confirm that based on personal experience.
Dust does not stick to urethane tires, so even if you clean them periodically the track will remain dusty. Urethane tires will get coated with the deposit from SILICONE tires and loose grip. When that happens the tires should be wiped with a cloth that is moistened with soap solution. Rolling on tape does not remove the residue.
Back in the mid '60s SILICONE tires were made for 1/24th cars, but they went out of favor by the late '60s. Recently Super Tires has introduced SILICONE and urethane tires for 1/24th cars. I expect that they will be increasingly popular with home racers while people that run on commercial raceways will continue to use foam tires with conditioner on them.
On HO tracks SILICONE coated foam tires usually perform somewhat better than solid Silicone tires, I have no experience with that on 1/24th tracks.
When my 1/32nd club ran both SILICONE and urethane tires neither type worked at their best. Based on my experience you would be better off sticking with a single type of tire. If you do run on rubber tires much of the time urethane is the best alternative.

[strangebrew]

I used silicone coated foam or uncoated foam tires on my small home oval track for years. I had the same conditions as RichD mentioned.
I bought some Paul Gauge tires for cars I was building for the P-Bop proxy & could not run more than 20 or 30 laps without the tires becoming
glazed over. I cleaned the tires & got the same results. My track surface is enamal painted masonite & has a very shiny finish. I had to wipe
my track down several times with laquer thinner before the PGT tires "came in" My masonite track does not take on a lot of rubber but the
urethane tires work very well now & do not become coated with any risidue. I'M JUST SAYIN'

[woodman]

Which tires start loosing traction first ...foam or silicone....My track is a glossy oil based finish, very smooth, with clean foam tires I get super traction , but they pick up dust pretty fast....

But the paul gage tires work regardless...just put the car on the track and start running....put on a foam tire car and it starts picking up dust

Be nice to coat foam tires with urethane,what about poly urethane?