WPAFB Air Force Museum

[dreinecke]

TsgtRet - It is a great place. I agree - most people drive right past the gate.

I thought the museum did a pretty good job of playing up their role in the prototypes. There were numerous ones that talked about having been outfitted/tested/developed at WPAFB.

[Modlerbob]

I can attest to the loudness of the KC-135s. We lived in Winter Park. Fl. due north of McCoy AFB about ten miles. McCoy was a SAC base and when the had an alert the KC-135s took off ahead of the B-52s so they could get into position for the first refueling. The KC-135s were full to the gills with jet fuel and to get more power out of the engines they had no noise abatement like their airliner cousins. Even by the time they got over our house they were still very low and very very loud. The B-52s were quiet by comparison. They all also messed up TV reception for the duration until the last B-52 was airborne.

[waaytoomuchintothis]

The 707 was one of the greatest planes ever, like its great granddaddy the DC-3. I always was glad they were still flying, if only as a flying gas station, for so long.

[ccobra]

They didn't have the F4D from Udorn RTAFB? One F4D had a pilot named Capt Richey and it had five Red Stars on it. There was also a Pilot name Col Olds that flew one of the F4D's there also Now if you want to see something exciting, you should see the F4E make a high speed low level pass. You only hear a a slight whistle but after it passes over head the decibel level goes well over 100. Another good sight is watching a slick wing F4 going down the runway during take off and before it reaches the halfway mark on the runway, the nose of the F4 goes straight up and quickly disappears into the clouds. The one thing I don't miss from Udorn was the two groups of two F4's taking off every 15 minutes, 24 hours a day and they thought O'hare was a busy airport. When the F4 carries six 500's on the center line, three 500's on each wing and with four aim-7's surrounding the center line load, it does make a little noise at takeoff.

[dreinecke]

Just got home - what a great trip! The LT is kicking tail at AFIT and taking names. We are real proud of him. He turned 23 while we were there...how I'd like to have been that on top of my game at that age. We also got to meet some of his friends. Funny enough, about 5 of his school mates from Lewis-Palmer HS in Monument, CO are attending or working at AFIT. Good group of young leaders.

They have Old's F4 there, that is the pic with LT in front of it. My neighbor may have also flown that bird at one time.

When I worked with the CES at Ramstein AFB we were on the flight line in the back of an AF pickup. Big F-250 Quad-cab. Sgt. thought it would be hilarious to tailgate an F4 heading to his hangar with us in the back. Besides being unable to breathe and hotter than a pork steak on Harry's BBQ, we stunk like jet fuel for at least a week. It took that long to get the smell off my skin and out of his nose. The payback when we got back to the shop was when the Chief smelled us and realized what happened. The Sgt. got reamed for putting a bunch of teens in harm's way. He was pretty sheepish after that ;)

You are right about one thing: F4's are NOT quiet. We lived right off the flight path in Machenbach. Those suckers made noise and so did the C5A's...those were still dragging the trees by the time they got to where we lived. I swore I could've walked faster.

[TsgtRet]

ccobra that's an F-4C in the museum that Col Olds flew and got his first 2 MIGS with.

Bob, the reason the KCs were so loud was that they used water injection to add mass and therefore more thrust. Early Buffs used the same set up (until the H model) but the KC was still louder.

The KC 135 is actually a Boeing 717, the fuselage is narrower and a foot shorter than a 707, though some parts are interchangeable. The government, in the past, has acquired surplus civilian 707s and put them in the boneyard to serve as parts sources.

The F-4 is still the big gun to my generation of Air Force types....I was in when the F-15s and 16s first entered service and I will never for get the patch one of the Phantom drivers had: "better a sister in a (house of ill repute) than a brother in F-15s"

[GoBucks]

Glad you had a great time visiting our great museum!!!! Thats one of the many things we employees at WPAFB really take pride in!!! Toooo bad you could not have stayed a few more days, (or at least another week, ha), Air Force Freedom Call is coming up June 27, its a fun family celebrations with music, food, flyovers and awesome fireworks. Then the next day is Dayton Airshow, June 28/29, this year the Navy is putting on their awesome show. So if that was not enough military/aviation entertainment for you, you could have stopped by and raced slots!!!!!

[GoBucks]

Oh and to TsgtRet!!!!!! Thanks for loaning us your aerial gas stations for a few weeks, makes our usually empty ramps look like a real flightline!!!!!

[dreinecke]

Gobucks - I would have loved to stop by, but it was an abbreviated trip and we only spent time with our son since it was so short. Next time I'll try to plan a slot car adventure around it!

You should take pride in the museum - every person that has flown or supported these magnificent planes should. It is the best air museum I've been too. I wish we could have stayed longer as I did see the Blue Angels were coming!!!

TsgtRet - while I LOVE the F4 and your comment absolutely cracked me up, I have to admit that the F-16 is like sugar to me - SWEET!!! I've always loved that bird too.

[TsgtRet]

Dave, granted the F-16 is a sports car compared to the F-4s more dump truck-like servicablility but it has also served in more roles and more air forces than the F-16. As I said before: "Worlds Largest Supplier of Used MIG Parts"

[ccobra]

to TSGTRET, I know he first flew the F4C but when I was at Udorn, the 555 was flying the F4D. I was a part of the 432nd that supported the 555 squad. At Udorn there was approximately 150 F4D, F4E, RF4C and at the time the new F4E Tissio complete with the leading edge slats and electronic eye. Something weird is my wife and I worked on the A10 when it first came out and our son in law also worked on them recently. With the A10, the flightline airmen are still getting cuts and bruises on their foreheads from the refueling door and the bomb racks.

[TsgtRet]

ccobra I was at the other end of the spectrum up in Iceland...we had the F-4Cs and they were among the oldest in the fleet, then in 1978 we transitioned into our "new" F-4Es and among them was the oldest E model in the fleet: 66 0300. Our aircrews were happy about getting the gun but unhappy with the age and condition of the hand-me-downs. At about that time McDouglas was delivering brand new E models complete with Tiseo to the Greek AF and they would stage through us wearing Greek camouflage and American markings. Anyway a Wizzo remarked to me while looking at one of these planes: "Once....just once... I'd like to fly a plane that no one else has ever flown before". Us maintenance types were sorry to see the C models leave.....much easier to deal with.

BTW since you're an old maintenance type, remember the question: "Are you the regular crew chief?" :D

[ccobra]

Wow, TsgtRet you did work on some old ones. The F4D's in Udorn were 65 models, The F4E were 67 and 68 models. Then when I was stationed at Clark in 75-77 I think those were 67 model F4E's. Working in the fuel tanks I never got asked about the regular crew chief. Since you are in NE Indiana were you there in the early sixties? I grew up in NW Indiana and our old school suffered a few broken windows from the Hustler stationed at Bunker Hill. I don't think I will ever forget those booms.

[TsgtRet]